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On 19 Aug 2004 02:56:30 GMT, darylgene DeleteThis @aol.comnopax (Daryl) wrote:
 >
 >believing that your mind is somehow supernaturally produce. But until
 >you can show how an immaterial being living in a timeless and
 >spaceless world is able to cause physical effects in this world, I am
 >not going to accept it as an explanation.
 >James
 >
  >>You turn things upside down,
  >>as if the potter were thought to be like the clay!
  >>Dwight
 >
 >If the potter told the clay it was molded in his image, it might make sense.
 >Daryl
 >
Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, "He did not make me"?
Can the pot say of the potter, "He knows nothing"?
Ciao,
Dwight Rejoice always.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 20:02:38 -0700, J.S.T. <spamfree DeleteThis @spamfree.com>
wrote:
   >>>... But until
   >>>you can show how an immaterial being living in a timeless and
   >>>spaceless world is able to cause physical effects in this world, I am
   >>>not going to accept it as an explanation.
   >>>James
  >>
  >> You turn things upside down,
  >>as if the potter were thought to be like the clay!
  >>
 >I enjoyed your down to earth analogy. Of course, it would not have
 >been possible without that beautiful thing we refer to as 'matter.'
Not mine, from the Source. Isaiah 29:16
 >
   >>>"My chief reason for choosing Christianity was because the
   >>>mysteries were incomprehensible. What's the point of revelation
   >>>if we could figure it out ourselves? If it were wholly
   >>>comprehensible, then it would just be another philosophy."
   >>>M. Adler
  >>
  >>Poor Mortimer, He would have been just as satisfied choosing black
  >>holes.
 >
 >Maybe even happier.
 >James
At least for a time. ;-o
Ciao,
Dwight Rejoice always.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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 >darylgene@aol.comnopax (Daryl) wrote:
wrote:


  >>You turn things upside down,
   >>>as if the potter were thought to be like the clay!
   >>>Dwight

  >>If the potter told the clay it was molded in his image, it might make sense.
  >>Daryl

 >Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, "He did not make me"?
 >Can the pot say of the potter, "He knows nothing"?

Wouldn't dream of it, but if the potter says you are like me, who am I to
question Him?


Daryl
And when He knew for certain, only drowning men could see Him.
He said all men shall be sailors then, until the sea shall free them.
(Leonard Cohen)
(remove nopax for e-mail)<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 20:02:38 -0700, J.S.T. wrote:

 > On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 17:32:40 GMT, DoTomkinsOutDratdSpam RemoveThis @yahoo.com
 > wrote:
 >
/snip/

  >> You turn things upside down,
  >>as if the potter were thought to be like the clay!
  >>
 > I enjoyed your down to earth analogy. Of course, it would not have
 > been possible without that beautiful thing we refer to as 'matter.'


That non-perceptible scientific construct called 'matter', which per Occam
does not really exist, as all our sensations and data (including clay) can
be explained without it.

In another sense of 'matter', per Berkeley (if I read him right), since
flour, clay etc do exist, then 'matter' does exist as a general name for
them; as 'food' exists as a general name for meat, bread, etc.


Mary<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 22:14:29 GMT, mooreffoc <"<m"@mooreffoc.com>>
wrote:

>> I enjoyed your down to earth analogy. Of course, it would not have
>> been possible without that beautiful thing we refer to as 'matter.'
>
>
>That non-perceptible scientific construct called 'matter', which per Occam
>does not really exist, as all our sensations and data (including clay) can
>be explained without it.

We'll simply have to agree to disagree on this one.
James
---------------------------------------------------
"We cannot even begin to sketch a process in which matter
comes from mind, but we have some idea what stages might
be involved in the developement of psychological attributes
in a material universe." Bede Rundle
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