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Robby the Robot: Asimovian?

 
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schultr

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Since: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: 75



(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:29 am
Post subject: Robby the Robot: Asimovian?
Archived from groups: alt>books>isaac-asimov (more info?)

The other night, I was watching the classic SF movie _Forbidden Planet_.
When the intrepid spacement arrive at Dr. Morbius's home on Altair-4, and
get worried about what Robby the Robot might do, Dr. Morbius explains that
the robot has built-in safeguards, and to demonstrate, he orders the
robot to stick its arm in a disintegration chamber, which the robot
obediently goes about doing (until Dr. Morbius countermands the order). He
then tells the robot to shoot a blaster at the spaceship's commander. The
robot tries to obey the order, but freezes up. To me, those two actions
sound pretty much like a demonstration of the Three Laws. Or is it just
a coincidence?

-----
Richard Schultz schultr.RemoveThis@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"French bread makes very good skis"

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oj3usmc

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Since: Mar 03, 2004
Posts: 217



(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:48 am
Post subject: Re: Robby the Robot: Asimovian? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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schultr.DeleteThis@mail.biu.ack.il (Richard Schultz) wrote:

>The other night, I was watching the classic SF movie _Forbidden Planet_.
>When the intrepid spacement arrive at Dr. Morbius's home on Altair-4, and
>get worried about what Robby the Robot might do, Dr. Morbius explains that
>the robot has built-in safeguards, and to demonstrate, he orders the
>robot to stick its arm in a disintegration chamber, which the robot
>obediently goes about doing (until Dr. Morbius countermands the order). He
>then tells the robot to shoot a blaster at the spaceship's commander. The
>robot tries to obey the order, but freezes up. To me, those two actions
>sound pretty much like a demonstration of the Three Laws. Or is it just
>a coincidence?

Probably not. Released in 1956, Forbidden Planet's writers,
producer, or director could easily have read some of IA's robot
stories [the first collection of which, I, Robot, was published
in 1950 or his first robot novel, The Caves of Steel, which was
published in 1954.

Or they could have read other SF writers who had picked up on and
chose to have their own robot creations, explicitly or
implicitly, observe the Three Laws.

On my first viewing of Forbidden Planet [on TV - well after its
theater release], I said to myself "The script writers have read
Isaac Asimov!" That thought has stayed with me after several
subsequent viewings, the last time a year or two ago on the TCM
cable network.

Forbidden Planet was a welcome respite from the usual run of
Follywood "pseudo-science fiction" movies populated with bug-eyed
monsters, atomically mutated insects, and, notably, a blob of
protoplasmic menace. One of an infinitesimal few Follywood
sci-fi movies that approached real science fiction. SF fans had
to wait for the small screen, and Twilight Zone, to get their
hunger eased.

[The Blob, notably because it starred the young Steve McQueen, a
new rising TV star soon to get his own spin-off (Wanted: Dead or
Alive) series from his/his character's appearances in TV's
Trackdown series, which starred another young actor, Robert Culp,
soon to be making a big name for himself. Notably, secondly,
because all of us who saw it as teen-agers during its first
release found it a real hoot instead of the screamer the
producers intended.]

--
OJ III

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dannyb

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Since: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 32



(Msg. 3) Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 3:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Robby the Robot: Asimovian? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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In <fpna4459cu81rgi3tubb0r57he2tefkft8.TakeThisOut@4ax.com> Ogden Johnson III <oj3usmc.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> writes:

>Forbidden Planet was a welcome respite from the usual run of
>Follywood "pseudo-science fiction" movies populated with bug-eyed
>monsters, atomically mutated insects, and, notably, a blob of
>protoplasmic menace.

However, they were kind enough to us viewers to include
the Pretty Earth Girl.

--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dannyb.TakeThisOut@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
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Joseph Nebus

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Since: Dec 05, 2006
Posts: 38



(Msg. 4) Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:15 pm
Post subject: Re: Robby the Robot: Asimovian? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Ogden Johnson III <oj3usmc.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> writes:

>schultr@mail.biu.ack.il (Richard Schultz) wrote:
>> To me, those two actions
>>sound pretty much like a demonstration of the Three Laws. Or is it just
>>a coincidence?

>Probably not. Released in 1956, Forbidden Planet's writers,
>producer, or director could easily have read some of IA's robot
>stories [the first collection of which, I, Robot, was published
>in 1950 or his first robot novel, The Caves of Steel, which was
>published in 1954.

I'm a touch surprised to discover not only don't I know as much
about the making of Forbidden Planet as I had assumed, but there's not
as much laying about ready to be picked up on the Internet as I would
have guessed. I don't see much of substance in background material on
a quick search, but Wikipedia's page about it does point out co-writer
for the screenplay, Allen Adler, as a science fiction writer with at
least one novel and, apparently, one other science fiction movie to his
credit (The Giant Behemoth).

Irving Block, another of the writers, has credits for other
clearly science fictional productions, including Rocketship X-M,
Invaders From Mars, War of the Satellites, and The 30 Foot Bride Of
Candy Rock.

That doesn't actually *demonstrate* much of anything, but it
seems reasonable to me that Adler or Block were reasonably familiar
with a highly successful science fiction convention like Asimov's
treatment of robots as having plausible safety precautions. That they
were obviously trying to make a grown-up movie avoiding the more silly
or sloppy conventions of movie science fiction underscores to me the
advantages of those.


However, it seems to me we can't overlook the good dramatic
need for Robbie to be unable to hurt a human being: when things start
attacking the C-57-D, it would be an obvious thing to suspect the robot
(in fact, as I remember without having seen the movie in ages they *do*),
so having it established that the robot can't possibly do harm to human
beings the mystery is heightened and hopefully the peril enhanced.

And there's also good dramatic value -- not to mention plot
advancement -- in Robbie being unable to attack the Creature From The
Id. That forces the story to have some reasonable justification for
Robbie's inability to be established ahead of time.

Then, too, the original Ariel was under instruction not to harm
the shipwrecked. This would seem to reverse the order of the relevant
Laws, but it has the same ultimate effect in the adaptation (granting
that there's elements of Ariel and Caliban mixed together in Robbie).

Anyway, there's a couple of plot points simplified or made
better by having Robbie obey a First Law equivalent, and it echoes a
piece from The Tempest, so it might be an independent invention of the
same dramatically useful premise.

--
Joseph Nebus
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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dannyb

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Since: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 32



(Msg. 5) Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:53 am
Post subject: Re: Robby the Robot: Asimovian? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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In <nebusj.1212540534 DeleteThis @vcmr-86.server.rpi.edu> nebusj- DeleteThis @-rpi-.edu (Joseph Nebus) writes:
[snip]

> Anyway, there's a couple of plot points simplified or made
>better by having Robbie obey a First Law equivalent, and it echoes a
>piece from The Tempest, so it might be an independent invention of the
>same dramatically useful premise.

"Forbidden Planet" takes plot devices from "The Tempest"?

Who'd have thunk it.

--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dannyb DeleteThis @panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
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schultr

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Since: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: 75



(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:48 am
Post subject: Re: Robby the Robot: Asimovian? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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In article <fpna4459cu81rgi3tubb0r57he2tefkft8 DeleteThis @4ax.com>, Ogden Johnson III <oj3usmc DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

: Probably not. Released in 1956, Forbidden Planet's writers,
: producer, or director could easily have read some of IA's robot
: stories [the first collection of which, I, Robot, was published
: in 1950 or his first robot novel, The Caves of Steel, which was
: published in 1954.

The Three Laws themselves date from the early 1940's, however.

: Forbidden Planet was a welcome respite from the usual run of
: Follywood "pseudo-science fiction" movies populated with bug-eyed
: monsters, atomically mutated insects, and, notably, a blob of
: protoplasmic menace. One of an infinitesimal few Follywood
: sci-fi movies that approached real science fiction. SF fans had
: to wait for the small screen, and Twilight Zone, to get their
: hunger eased.

I thought it was pretty funny that they refused to give William
Shakespeare on-screen credit. I guess they figured that he would
not be likely to cause the producers any trouble.

-----
Richard Schultz schultr DeleteThis @mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"an optimist is a guy/ that has never had/ much experience"
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schultr

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Since: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: 75



(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:48 am
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In article <g23pj6$ljh$1@reader2.panix.com>, danny burstein <dannyb DeleteThis @panix.com> wrote:
: In <fpna4459cu81rgi3tubb0r57he2tefkft8 DeleteThis @4ax.com> Ogden Johnson III <oj3usmc DeleteThis @yahoo.com> writes:

:>Forbidden Planet was a welcome respite from the usual run of
:>Follywood "pseudo-science fiction" movies populated with bug-eyed
:>monsters, atomically mutated insects, and, notably, a blob of
:>protoplasmic menace.

: However, they were kind enough to us viewers to include
: the Pretty Earth Girl.

In a mini-skirt, yet.

-----
Richard Schultz schultr DeleteThis @mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"How many boards would the Mongols hoard if the Mongol hordes got bored?"
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oj3usmc

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Since: Mar 03, 2004
Posts: 217



(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:52 am
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schultr DeleteThis @mail.biu.ack.il (Richard Schultz) wrote:

>Ogden Johnson III <oj3usmc DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

>: Forbidden Planet was a welcome respite from the usual run of
>: Follywood "pseudo-science fiction" movies populated with bug-eyed
>: ...

>I thought it was pretty funny that they refused to give William
>Shakespeare on-screen credit. I guess they figured that he would
>not be likely to cause the producers any trouble.

Their prime target audience, teenagers on dates at drive-in
movies, would have stayed away in droves had they learned they
were being fed Shakespeare. ;->

OTOH, Roger Corman and Vincent price teamed up for a series of
successful attempts to introduce them to Edgar Allan Poe. ;->

--
OJ III
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