Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed

Len Oil <lenoil.TakeThisOut@lenoil.demon.co.uk> writes:

> /I/ might have vaguely referred to the possibilities of more books set
> in all kinds of places that might bear some (or more) inspection,
> including Agatean Empire, Krull, Howondaland, Llamedos, the
> Nothjingfjord area; and even then not restrict myself to Vimes but
> merely list him amongst the Librarian, Ponder, Susan, Mrs Cosmopolite,
> Detritus, Hwel and, these days, Moist as people that might find
> themselves interestingly out-of-place/strangely in-place in some or
> all of these situations. And even then I'd try to make it vague and
> widespread enough to /try/ not to tread upon any Terry-shaped toes
> (probably diluting my thoughts down to zero in the process), and then
> junk the reply before sending (BTDTGTT-S)

Hmmm.... Does this mean that pTerry is now never going to write "The
Fiery Crow" as Vernor Vinge stated he would do at some future point in
his own book "Rainbow's End?" Given that VV has it there's "The
Sultanate of Abu Dajeeb" just south of "Sumarbad" in that book --
clearly the Klatchian end of the disk -- it seems clear to me that the
OP has just nobbled TFC before it was born...

Cheers,

Matthew, who would like to get hold of a copy of Jerzy Hacek's
"Librarians Militant" stories.

--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 7 Priory Courtyard
Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
Kent, CT11 9PW
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

Minun olisi pitänyt tietää, olisi pitänyt tietää,
olisi pitänyt tietää KUKA SINÄ OLET, Matthew Seaman:
> Len Oil <lenoil.DeleteThis@lenoil.demon.co.uk> writes:

>> /I/ might have vaguely referred to the possibilities of more books set
>> in all kinds of places that might bear some (or more) inspection,
>> including Agatean Empire, Krull, Howondaland, Llamedos, the
>> Nothjingfjord area; and even then not restrict myself to Vimes but
>> merely list him amongst the Librarian, Ponder, Susan, Mrs Cosmopolite,
>> Detritus, Hwel and, these days, Moist as people that might find
>> themselves interestingly out-of-place/strangely in-place in some or
>> all of these situations. And even then I'd try to make it vague and
>> widespread enough to /try/ not to tread upon any Terry-shaped toes
>> (probably diluting my thoughts down to zero in the process), and then
>> junk the reply before sending (BTDTGTT-S)

> Hmmm.... Does this mean that pTerry is now never going to write "The
> Fiery Crow" as Vernor Vinge stated he would do at some future point in
> his own book "Rainbow's End?" Given that VV has it there's "The
> Sultanate of Abu Dajeeb" just south of "Sumarbad" in that book --
> clearly the Klatchian end of the disk -- it seems clear to me that the
> OP has just nobbled TFC before it was born...

In the OP's defense, one would hope that the subject "speculation warning"
would have kept Pterry out of this thread, even with a damaged brain.

And yes, I think my own personal brain damage gives me license to make
cracks like that.

rich
--
-to reply, it's hot not warm
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
\ Rich Hammett http://home.hiwaay.net/~rhammett
/ Barry Goldwater: "Every good Christian should line up
\ and kick Jerry Falwell's ass."
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

rich hammett wrote:
> In the OP's defense, one would hope that the subject "speculation warning"
> would have kept Pterry out of this thread, even with a damaged brain.

I think it would. I think it would also make him think twice about
being active in the group and it might easily spark off a mildly
aggrieved message to that effect. After all, us 'proper fans' (FCVO)
might think he'd not sneak a look, but it's still fuel for any
axe-grinders trawling the electronic highways and byways. Nobody can
say (without possibly a timely forensic analysis of his hard-drive)
whether he did sneak a look and pinch the idea, but detractors could
also point out that it can't be proven (even /with/ the forensics) that
he /didn't/ do so.

I wasn't here at the time of the original rule-setting (whatever form
the "look guys, could you not..." statement took as its form) and I
don't want to be the Jobsworth 'new monkey' about this[1], but I hope
the idea is understood. In-between my general verbosity. (And above my
rather over-long footnote, that is probably apocryphal anyway.)



[1] The New Monkey Experiment (paraphrased) is as follows:
1) Get a group of monkeys or other socially aware creatures (without any
overly dominant individuals), large enough to make a handful of
individuals the 'initial society' and still have at least as many again
left for substitution purposes. Give them a suitable environment to
live comfortably, within which is a platform or other 'demarcation zone'
from which they can access a treat of some kind (bananas, nuts, etc)
over and above their everyday foodstuffs. Have prepared something like
hoses or water-pistols or sprinklers that can provide an uncomfortable
(but non-harmful) 'punishment', and activate the punishment whenever an
individual creature goes to get the treat, ideally only upon the
remainder of the test subjects within the environment. Do not allow the
'reserve' test subjects to observe the process.
2) With suitable test subjects, the 'initial society' will be observed
to learn the connection between one of their number going for the treat
and the rest being squirted with water, or equivalent. Assuming you did
not use members of the Simpsons family as test subjects, you should find
that this results in a 'taboo' being set up, and none of the subjects
are willing to break the taboo and incur the displeasure of their fellow
subjects. When you do so, remove one test subject at random and replace
with a 'fresh' subject from the so far 'unacclimatised' group.
3) Witness that the new member does not immediately understand that
there is a taboo, while the remaining members of the original will
discourage the new member from attempting to take the treat. The new
subject will learn through this that there is a taboo, though may or may
not witness the 'punishment' behind it, if the rest of the group are
sufficiently motivated to prevent its activation.
4) Once the new member has been properly 'integrated', swap another
'original' out for a new individual. Again, the taboo will be enforced,
and the first of the 'fresh' individuals should be among the enforcers.
Repeat the swapping-out until the group entirely consists of subjects
that have no direct experience of the original punishment.
5) Note that any further freshly introduced subjects will be discouraged
from breaking the taboo, even if the experimenters no longer need or
wish to apply the 'punishment', and the current 'generation' of
enforcers do not know why it is that they are 'enforcing' the taboo.
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

<jdewitt50 RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> Speculation warning space
>
> 10
<snip>

Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate to your
heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about speculating about
coming events in DW:

"It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about future
events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as of now (as of
this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
fan.pratchett."

A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.

-- Dave

Read my latest astronomy column!
http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

on 28/12/2007 02:20 Len Oil said the following:
> rich hammett wrote:
>> In the OP's defense, one would hope that the subject "speculation warning"
>> would have kept Pterry out of this thread, even with a damaged brain.
>
> I think it would. I think it would also make him think twice about
> being active in the group and it might easily spark off a mildly
> aggrieved message to that effect.

<snip>

Indeed.

http://www.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/leaving.html

See the foot of the page for posts directly relating to ABP.

esmi
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

Dave Adalian wrote:
> <jdewitt50 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>> Speculation warning space
>>
>> 10
> <snip>
>
> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate to your
> heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about speculating about
> coming events in DW:
>
> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about future
> events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as of now (as of
> this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
> fan.pratchett."
>
> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.

If you don't mind, I'd like to still worry. PTerry has been back to AxP
(and left again, for various announced or unannounced reasons) since
that time, and it still comes down not to whether he /is/ reading our
speculation (which is bad enough), but whether someone can plausibly
think and/or intimate that he has done.

The worst circumstance I can think of is where a future DW book follows
a plot that /by pure chance/ has been freely pre-speculated upon within
these groups completely unbeknownst to Terry[1]. There being absolutely
no restraint on our part nor indication to him that he should pursue a
different tack. It could cause /significant/ unfortunate problems.


If we can stick to the policy of discussion /without undue speculation/,
then we can have fun, the author can visit us or not with no fear nor
favour, the Disc can continue to spin on its axis and the only things we
need to worry about are the "Embuggerance" issue and the utter
mis-casting of David Jason as Moist Von Lipwig by the time The Mob gets
around to filming GP/MM/RT...


[1] After all, as a group we've probably managed to tune into some of
the native Pratchett psychology about how stories go, sufficient to get
at least one feasibly direct hit out of a vast number of stabs in the
dark...
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

Dave Adalian wrote:
> <jdewitt50 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>> Speculation warning space
>>
>> 10
> <snip>
>
> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate to your
> heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about speculating about
> coming events in DW:
>
> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about future
> events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as of now (as of
> this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
> fan.pratchett."
>
> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.
>
> -- Dave
>
> Read my latest astronomy column!
> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>
>
Just curious about the date of that because I have had one comment
regarding a post I made which must have been after Nov 2005 as I know it
was when using this PC rather than my older equipment. (Google concurs
it would appear)
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

"Len Oil" <lenoil DeleteThis @lenoil.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:fl3v2m$8es$1$830fa795@news.demon.co.uk...
> Dave Adalian wrote:
>> <jdewitt50 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>> Speculation warning space
>>>
>>> 10
>> <snip>
>>
>> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate to
>> your heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about speculating
>> about coming events in DW:
>>
>> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about
>> future events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as of
>> now (as of this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
>> fan.pratchett."
>>
>> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.
>
> If you don't mind, I'd like to still worry. PTerry has been back to AxP
> (and left again, for various announced or unannounced reasons) since that
> time, and it still comes down not to whether he /is/ reading our
> speculation (which is bad enough), but whether someone can plausibly think
> and/or intimate that he has done.

Please yourself. I can certainly understand why you would want to keep the
alt.X.pratchett groups "pure," but I'll go with Pterry as the last word on
the subject. So, until he says it is something we should worry about, I'm
not going to worry about it. Besides, who's got time to spend on things
like that?

-- Dave

Read my latest astronomy column!
http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

"Reader in Invisible Writings" <markfoweraker.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:47758124$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> Dave Adalian wrote:
>> <jdewitt50.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>> Speculation warning space
>>>
>>> 10
>> <snip>
>>
>> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate to
>> your heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about speculating
>> about coming events in DW:
>>
>> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about
>> future events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as of
>> now (as of this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
>> fan.pratchett."
>>
>> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.
>>
>> -- Dave
>>
>> Read my latest astronomy column!
>> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
> Just curious about the date of that because I have had one comment
> regarding a post I made which must have been after Nov 2005 as I know it
> was when using this PC rather than my older equipment. (Google concurs it
> would appear)

One comment by whom regarding what? Do you mean Pterry posting to the
group? Do you mean a comment by another reader telling you not to speculate
on future plot lines after Pterry had said it was OK to do so?

"The AFP Timelines: Terry Pratchett 'leaves' AFP" page that explains when
Pterry left AFP (3 Feb. 1999 -- the date of the quote I posted above) and
ABP (10 March 1999) and why is here:

http://www.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/leaving.html

-- Dave

Read my latest astronomy column!
http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

Dave Adalian wrote:
> "Reader in Invisible Writings" <markfoweraker.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:47758124$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
>> Dave Adalian wrote:
>>> <jdewitt50.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>>> Speculation warning space
>>>>
>>>> 10
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate to
>>> your heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about speculating
>>> about coming events in DW:
>>>
>>> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about
>>> future events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as of
>>> now (as of this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
>>> fan.pratchett."
>>>
>>> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.
>>>
>>> -- Dave
>>>
>>> Read my latest astronomy column!
>>> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>> Just curious about the date of that because I have had one comment
>> regarding a post I made which must have been after Nov 2005 as I know it
>> was when using this PC rather than my older equipment. (Google concurs it
>> would appear)
>
> One comment by whom regarding what? Do you mean Pterry posting to the
> group? Do you mean a comment by another reader telling you not to speculate
> on future plot lines after Pterry had said it was OK to do so?
>
> "The AFP Timelines: Terry Pratchett 'leaves' AFP" page that explains when
> Pterry left AFP (3 Feb. 1999 -- the date of the quote I posted above) and
> ABP (10 March 1999) and why is here:
>
> http://www.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/leaving.html
>
> -- Dave
>
> Read my latest astronomy column!
> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>
>
Sorry, I had one comment (something on the lines of 'nicely put') in
response to a post I had made and the signature made it appear to be
from TP (or someone posing as him). As this was post 1999 I would have
presumed that he (unless there is an occasional phantom TP) had come
back at that time. Whether he is still reading I don't know, but would
prefer to err on the side of caution.
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

On Fri, 28 Dec 2007 15:17:00 -0800, Dave Adalian
<dave.adalian.RemoveThis@PLZNOSPAMsbcglobal.net> wrote:
<snip>
>"The AFP Timelines: Terry Pratchett 'leaves' AFP" page that explains when
>Pterry left AFP (3 Feb. 1999 -- the date of the quote I posted above) and
>ABP (10 March 1999) and why is here:
>
>http://www.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/leaving.html

And like at least 90% of all web pages, that's out of date. Terry's been
back, left, come back and left again, and come back, give or take work and
health several times since March 1999.

Put me down as another "please don't speculate here" vote.

--
Andy Brown
Pascal - A programming language named after a man who would turn over in his
grave if he knew about it.
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

Reader in Invisible Writings wrote:
> Dave Adalian wrote:
>> "Reader in Invisible Writings" <markfoweraker DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in
>> message news:47758124$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
>>> Dave Adalian wrote:
>>>> <jdewitt50 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>> Speculation warning space
>>>>>
>>>>> 10
>>>> <snip>
>>>>
>>>> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so speculate
>>>> to your heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about
>>>> speculating about coming events in DW:
>>>>
>>>> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate about
>>>> future events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So I am, as
>>>> of now (as of this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe to alt.
>>>> fan.pratchett."
>>>>
>>>> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.
>>>>
>>>> -- Dave
>>>>
>>>> Read my latest astronomy column!
>>>> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>>> Just curious about the date of that because I have had one comment
>>> regarding a post I made which must have been after Nov 2005 as I know
>>> it was when using this PC rather than my older equipment. (Google
>>> concurs it would appear)
>>
>> One comment by whom regarding what? Do you mean Pterry posting to the
>> group? Do you mean a comment by another reader telling you not to
>> speculate on future plot lines after Pterry had said it was OK to do so?
>>
>> "The AFP Timelines: Terry Pratchett 'leaves' AFP" page that explains
>> when Pterry left AFP (3 Feb. 1999 -- the date of the quote I posted
>> above) and ABP (10 March 1999) and why is here:
>>
>> http://www.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/leaving.html
>>
>> -- Dave
>>
>> Read my latest astronomy column!
>> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>>
> Sorry, I had one comment (something on the lines of 'nicely put') in
> response to a post I had made and the signature made it appear to be
> from TP (or someone posing as him). As this was post 1999 I would have
> presumed that he (unless there is an occasional phantom TP) had come
> back at that time. Whether he is still reading I don't know, but would
> prefer to err on the side of caution.
Update (although I did not find precisely what I was looking for, GG on
"carefully put" found a Terry Pratchett responing to DW plays in
alt.books.pratchett 10/4/2002 and the profile indicates activity in 1994
2002 and 2003. Mmmm.
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed 

In a speech called 47758604$1_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com,
Reader in Invisible Writings <markfoweraker.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> said:
> Dave Adalian wrote:
>> "Reader in Invisible Writings" <markfoweraker.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in
>> message news:47758124$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
>>> Dave Adalian wrote:
>>>> <jdewitt50.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:788d50df-e789-44aa-a0ea-a6612b8896fb@x29g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> Speculation warning space
>>>>>
>>>>> 10
>>>> <snip>
>>>>
>>>> Pterry made it clear he's not reading the posts here, so
>>>> speculate
>>>> to your heart's content. In fact, this is what he said about
>>>> speculating about coming events in DW:
>>>>
>>>> "It would be ridiculous to expect a fan group not to speculate
>>>> about future events on DW -- it's a fundamental part of fanac. So
>>>> I am, as of now (as of this post, in fact) ceasing to subscribe
>>>> to
>>>> alt. fan.pratchett."
>>>>
>>>> A bit later he did the same thing here. So, no worries.
>>>>
>>>> -- Dave
>>>>
>>>> Read my latest astronomy column!
>>>> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>>> Just curious about the date of that because I have had one comment
>>> regarding a post I made which must have been after Nov 2005 as I
>>> know it was when using this PC rather than my older equipment.
>>> (Google concurs it would appear)
>>
>> One comment by whom regarding what? Do you mean Pterry posting to
>> the group? Do you mean a comment by another reader telling you not
>> to speculate on future plot lines after Pterry had said it was OK
>> to
>> do so? "The AFP Timelines: Terry Pratchett 'leaves' AFP" page that
>> explains when Pterry left AFP (3 Feb. 1999 -- the date of the quote
>> I posted above) and ABP (10 March 1999) and why is here:
>>
>> http://www.lspace.org/fandom/afp/timelines/leaving.html
>>
>> -- Dave
>>
>> Read my latest astronomy column!
>> http://starry-starry-nights.blogspot.com/
>>
>>
> Sorry, I had one comment (something on the lines of 'nicely put') in
> response to a post I had made and the signature made it appear to be
> from TP (or someone posing as him). As this was post 1999 I would
> have presumed that he (unless there is an occasional phantom TP) had
> come back at that time. Whether he is still reading I don't know,
> but would prefer to err on the side of caution.

A quick Google Groups for PTerry's name sorted by date of posting
shows that his last post to the alt.*.pratchett groups was 20/7/07.
He's made a few posts to other groups since then
(alt.games.elder-scrolls and alt.fan.harry-potter), but he's certainly
been present in the fan groups dedicated to him since that post in
1999. He's come back. And until we see another post from him saying
he's leaving (for whatever reason), please keep the speculation to an
absolute minimum, and if possible, hidden completely from these
groups.

--
www.sabremeister.me.uk
www.livejournal.com/users/sabremeister/
Use brian at sabremeister dot me dot uk to reply
"The men who really believe in themselves are all in lunatic asylums."
- GK Chesterton
 >> Stay informed about: Speculation Warning - Minor Spoliers - 71 Hour Ahmed